Food Safety Talk 37: Inoculating the Plane

The guys started with some follow up on The Wire, The Newsroom, what colored food does to your poop, Mike Batz’ link to Craig Goldwyn’s Huffington Post article on sprouts, T. gondii in Romanian animals, and F’ed up.

Aaron’s email then prompted a discussion about Plague Inc., the CDC’s interest in it and CDC’s own game Solve the Outbreak. The guys were impressed by how progressive the CDC is in terms of social media and new ways of engaging the public.

Don then provided some info about HDScores, a company that plans to make Restaurant Inspection Scores from 3100 jurisdictions from the US, Canada and UK widely available. This prompted a discussion about making restaurant scores available to the public in an interpretable way.

Ben shared his experiences from a recent trip to Calgary, where his 4 year old son Jack got sick, possibly with Norovirus. Ben was fascinated by Delta Airlines’ approach of dealing with the vomit problem, which involved plastic bags to contain the risk and coffee pods to manage the smell. Don was familiar with the approach thanks to Roderick on the Line. Ben didn’t agree with Delta’s decision to take them off plane first (thus inoculating the plane).  It reminded him of two different articles. Both Don and Ben were glad Delta had a plan, even if they didn’t quite agree with the whole plan.

Don then wanted to ask Ben about a Meatingplace article by Richard Raymond entitled Is our food safer than five years ago? (free registration needed to read). Ben explained why he didn’t agree with Richard’s arguments. Don agreed and asked aloud about conspiracy theories, not dissimilar from those surrounding New Coke.

Don then wanted get Ben’s take on the IFT’s March 2013 media update. In fact both Ben and Don thought that these updates were way over the top and it reminded them of "The louder he talked of his honor, the faster we counted our spoons” and Doug Powell’s comment on Barfblog “I'm immediately suspicious of people … who say trust me.” Ben especially didn’t like that organizations say “trust us” and without telling people what the risks are and why they should be trusted. The discussion of food processing reminded Don of Richard Wrangham’s great book "Catching Fire: How Cooking Made Us Human.”

The last thing on Ben’s agenda was Doug’s comparison between the porn industry and the food industry, which had resulted in a fair bit of backlash against the legendary Doug. Ben noted that Doug’s point was how the two industries differed in how they manage the risks, which people missed. And boy… you mention porn and people get excited.

Food Safety Talk 36: Better Collaboration Without Pants

After some initial expected Skype problems the guys talked about a range of topics including their favorite beers, Apple phobias, The Wire, about (not) working from home and Telecommuting policies, writing papers using DragonDictate, Don’s Squarespace 6 trial and Ben’s The Newsroom sharing system.

The guys then critiqued some obfuscated food safety messages about Listeria put out by the Partnership for Food Safety Education. The discussion then turned to the horse meat scandal and that audits are a tool rather than the tool. This reminded Don of the Chinese melamine incident and labeling fraud.

The guys then took a short podcasting detour to Scott Simpson’s Your Monkey Called article for The Magazine entitled You’re boring. It made them think about the stories they are trying to tell in podcast episodes, blog articles or presentations.

This reminded Ben of the story of Ashley’s  lack of emotion to a Norovirus outbreak on UNC campus, but we don’t know how she would react to Carolyn Dunn’s story on Food Myths and Memes of no baby carrots. This turned into a chat about kale, Brussels sprouts, beets, asparagus and bodily functions.

Ben then shared his surprise of reading about accelerated aging canned food, which prompted Don to think about a couple of early food science books – Ted Labuza’s “Shelf-Life Dating of Foods” and Harold McGee’s “Curious Cook.” Though Don wasn’t too keen on the idea of aging canned food.

The guys then wondered about how a Michigan firm could be operating without a HACCP plan and the subsequent recall. Don then got grumpy about Candy eggs that have all been cleared of Salmonella. Then Ben got on his favorite soap box about the lack of information that is being provided.

In the after dark the guys talked about Mobee Magic Charger, HyperJuice 2 external batteries, Don’s ski hat and Ben's toque ,and Ben’s fantasy baseball.​

Food Safety Talk 34: Don't puke up the doughnuts

Participating in the Krispy Kreme Challenge challenged Ben in more ways than one. Don is looking for a new podcasting mic and he is getting some guidance from Dan Benjamin’s guide. The guys discussed the download statistics for the podcast and Folding Text to manage their pre-show notes, as well as Don’s homework, The Newsroom (Canadian TV series), which prompted Don to correctly note the excessive plaid fashions. Bill Hallman had provided some further thoughts on the “no illness language” in recall notices (FST Episode 33) which led to a broader discussion about recalls, including one for Listeria in Crab Dip.

The discussion continued with Listeria, namely Missa Bay LLC's recall due to Listeria in apple slices  and the more recent FDA warning letter to the company. Don and Ben were surprised by where and how much Listeria was found by the FDA. The guys agreed that the publication of these warning letters was a good thing – not only for customers, but also to provide valuable information to suppliers of similar products – which reminded Ben of the Blue Pages for teachers.

The guys then switched to the Chicago Tribune article “Triclosan: Anti-bacterial soaps called useless, potentially dangerous” that Don had been interviewed for (based on his publication “A Meta-Analysis of the Published Literature on the Effectiveness of Antimicrobial Soaps.”) The average benefit of antimicrobial soaps over normal soaps was about 0.5 log, or 63%, and Don explained that the benefits were greatest when the contamination levels of hands were high, for example after handling raw meat and poultry or after cleaning up vomit.

Then Ben and Don got back into the reusable bag discussion. This was prompted by an article by Klick and Wright (not Watson and Crick). Klick and Wright combined Gerba, Williams and Sinclair’s research on bacteria in reusable shopping bags with a pathogenic E. coli related illnesses and deaths in hospital in the San Francisco area. They concluded that the ban on grocery bags led to an increase of 5.4 additional deaths per year, though Ben got really fired up on Barfblog about the lack of epidemiology and microbiology evident in the article. Don also took issue with a couple of lawyers mistaking correlation with causation and recalled FST Episode 19 where the guys had discussed reusable bags, which Carl Custer likes to call nickel bags (or check out this link).

Ben then shared that that his department was advertising a local food extension / research position to collect evidence for a range of possible impacts of local food systems, including food safety, nutrition, or related areas. This led to a discussion about local food systems and Don was all in favor of fresh food, such as the locally source food available at Wegmans.

In the after dark the guys geeked out with Folding Text, Markdown and its syntax, the octothorpe (not to be confused with Dr. Octavius from Spider-Man 2), Ben’s Garage Band workflow, Apple messages for the Mac, and Ken Finkleman.

Food Safety Talk 34: Don't Puke Up the Doughnuts

Food Safety Talk 27: A Bumper Crop of Fun: The Clostridium Episode

The podcast stars with a discussion of the Violet Femmes, AC/DC, Ben’s recently acquired addiction to The Wire (he’s up to Episode 6), and the reason for why Don doesn’t need to feel guilty for not doing his homework – to watch The Newsroom.

Recently, Don had a call from a consumer who had made salsa (three weeks prior) but had forgotten to add the lemon juice. She wanted to know what she could do. The guys agreed that the concern was due to Clostridium botulinum which could grow in a low-acid environment and lead to toxin outgrowth (some guidance is provided in this NDSU document) and the best option is to discard the salsa.

This reminded Ben of the judging of the home food preservation competition of the North Carolina State Fair. He explained how he’s introduced additional food safety science into the judging process – with respect to which foods to taste and alternative criteria for evaluation. Ben’s got a set of criteria he uses to determine whether to exclude products from the competition (based on whether the product comes from a tested recipe source such as NCHFP, Ball's Blue Book or USDA's Guide to Home Canning), whether to allow for tasting and ensure that recommended processing times have been used (self-reported by the participants). Judges don't taste any high risk foods (e.g. beets), and they test pH of the lower risk products. Ben reviews the competition premium book annually to ensure things are clear. Don liked Ben’s approach and encouraged him to write his process up for the Journal of Extension.

The conversation then focused on the safety of a brandied fruit starter recipe that Ben has been asked to evaluate. Given the acidity of the canned ingredients, and while E. coli O157 could be an issue, the guys agreed that the major concern is again Clostridium botulinum. In particular, Don was concerned about ‘cooks’ who don’t follow the recipe and replace canned fruit with fresh fruit or sugar with honey – both of which are likely to introduce C. botulinum into the mixture. Don cited the recent outbreak of botulism in a prison from Pruno as an example of such innovative behavior. Ben then queried the effect of refrigeration, which Don thought would have an impact on C. botulinum spores, but might also impact the fermentation. This reminded Ben of his early days in extension work when he was asked about an Amish Friendship Bread starter, which has been researched and found to present little risk if done properly.

The conversation the shifted to cooking and serving large amounts of chili, as Ben had been asked about food safety considerations for a chili supper fundraiser. Ben put the organizers in touch with the local environmental health officers to make sure they comply with the necessary regulations. In addition, he provided them with some information about how to achieve rapid cooling (and why it was important). While doing his research for this question he found an article on Clostridium perfringens during cooling in commercial chili. Don has been involved in similar extension work on roast beef for which he used this FSIS Appendix B. In addition, Don noted that for many practical applications the ComBase Perfringens Predictor is a great tool.

The guys made a fleeting comment about the current XL beef E. coli O157 outbreak, which they may discuss more next time.

Food Safety Talk 27: A Bumper Crop of Fun: The Clostridium Episode